thumbs 2017-03-09 13:54:22
afsto: how can we help you?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 13:56:21
Hello folks - irc noob here...and I wanted to know the best way to get help regaining sysop access to a channel I created sometime ago...
KindOne 2017-03-09 13:58:32
cyberzeus: # or ## channel?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 13:58:55
This was a # channel - again, I am a noob...
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 13:59:14
nobody has barked at me about using it so I figured it was cool even though single-# is for "offical" only
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 13:59:31
and it is not a channel name likely to b used by anyone else
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:00:49
cyberzeus: you can only reclaim access to a primary channel if you represent an on-topic group or project by that name.
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:01:02
cyberzeus: if you don't, you must use the ## variant now.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:01:12
ok - will the channel just die away then?
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:01:29
cyberzeus: until someone with a valid claim for it comes along, yes.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:01:45
the only people using it are bascially me and one other individual
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:01:53
cyberzeus: right. It doesn't matter.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:02:06
is there a process to make a "valid claim"
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:02:09
cyberzeus: you can keep using it without registering it, if you like.
afsto 2017-03-09 14:02:32
I am looking for a cloak.
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:02:37
cyberzeus: the problem is that you don't have a valid claim to that channel.
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:02:58
afsto: You're not identified.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:03:14
well the documentation says if not used by someone and not registered, it is apparently fine to register
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:03:26
cyberzeus: not really.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:03:27
maybe the stuff on freenode.net is outdated
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:03:48
Sounds like you're talking about registering a nick.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:04:01
no - definitely a channel
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:04:17
cyberzeus: see https://freenode.net/policies (search for Channel ownership)
afsto 2017-03-09 14:05:29
sorry,I have done it now.
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:07:00
Yep. You just have to await a response from a staff member.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:09:15
NightTrain - was that for me?
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:10:11
No
afsto 2017-03-09 14:10:11
Is there anythings I need to do to get a cloak?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
So I'm going to say I would have a claim given that the channel was created for a single on-topic purpose
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:10:11
(was for afsto)
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
I did not register it at the time...
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:10:11
cyberzeus: what's the channel?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
#lednet
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:10:11
what is 'lednet' about?
dax 2017-03-09 14:10:11
afsto: cloak is done, it's active now and will also activate on future connections when you identify to nickserv
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
also, all I did to create this was "/join #lednet" - again, this was 1-2 years back...
afsto 2017-03-09 14:10:11
Thankyou very much!
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
I have a mutil-site encypted network doing testing on things like TOT
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:10:11
cyberzeus: unfortunately, you most likely used the wrong namespace initially, and there is no current limitation to prevent this from happening
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:10:11
cyberzeus: that doesn't sound very on-topic
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
"lednet" is not any kind of corporate regiuster name - it is a name I've used since I bagn the project a couple years back
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:10:11
cyberzeus: does your project have an established online presence?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
well yes and no
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
but not publically like a website
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:10:11
but yes it is online as in that it used the Internet
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:10:11
cyberzeus: then you don't really have an established off-IRC presence
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:13:25
@amnet: Thx - and I did try that...but apparently, after I had all of the users leave the channel, the ownership was grabbed by freenode staff...
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:13:43
So while not reg'd by me - it is now under their ownership...
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:13:44
cyberzeus: right. That's normal for channels in the primary namespace.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:13:56
Hence my questions here...
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:14:00
Anyway - thanks folks
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:14:02
freenode-staff became the successor and the subsequent owner when the founder's nick dropped.
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:14:07
cyberzeus: it prevents someone else registering the channel without a valid claim to it.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:14:41
@thumbs - right - which is what I was trying to resolve here - to get it back from freenode staff...
amnet 2017-03-09 14:14:54
cyberzeus: Any chanop can register a channel.
gildarts 2017-03-09 14:14:54
Not so much "grabbed" as it automatically switches to staff when no on "owns it"
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:15:08
amnet: you're not really "helping"
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:15:29
Yeah - again, noob here and I had not yet discovered the register nick and channel commands...my baad on all that
amnet 2017-03-09 14:15:43
thumbs: You're not either.
amnet 2017-03-09 14:15:48
In general.
gry 2017-03-09 14:15:53
cyberzeus: what are you going to do now? what's the plan? and how many people are there in the channel?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:16:29
@gry: Seems like I have only one plan - I'm being told I cannot reclaim my original channel so I will need to sue 2# I guess
gry 2017-03-09 14:16:32
amnet: that's a harsh remark; it helps to point out the flaws in each particular answer (your answer, for instance, hasn't provided any new information compared to what was already said)
amnet 2017-03-09 14:16:32
cyberzeus: Yeah, freenode doesn't moderate by IP as far as intrachannel politics goes.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:16:37
sorry -use 2#
amnet 2017-03-09 14:16:55
So they don't really care about IP of original /join'er.
gry 2017-03-09 14:17:08
cyberzeus: do you have access to altering the channel topic to point the current channel members to the new channel?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:17:23
hey folks - all of the discussion has been helpful to me so no need to melee over it...I appreciate all the feedback at present
amnet 2017-03-09 14:17:29
Modern IRC is generally Service oriented, so they respect NickServ authority for the most part.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:18:03
@gry: no - I do not beleive I have those rights
gry 2017-03-09 14:19:00
cyberzeus: what does '/mode #chan' tell you? and how many people are there at present?
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:19:00
Pseudo user "freenode staff" is the only entry on the access list.
gry 2017-03-09 14:19:06
(replacing #chan with your channel name)
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:19:30
since there's only a few folks in his channel, it's simple to simply /msg them or send them a memo about the change to the ## namespace.
thumbs 2017-03-09 14:19:42
a few regulars, anyway.
amnet 2017-03-09 14:20:05
thumbs: This isn't a namespace issue.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:20:17
@gry: +cnt
gry 2017-03-09 14:20:30
ok, i see
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:20:57
@gry: when I initially created, I was the admin - obviously - but then I disconnected and that was that
gildarts 2017-03-09 14:21:04
amnet: why not?
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:33:51
@amnet: so it sounds like the "creating freely licensed output" is a ket determinator re: on-topic single-# eligible naming - this sound correct?
amnet 2017-03-09 14:34:54
I'm not staff or anything so I don't really feel comfortable commenting on that in any direct capacity.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:35:18
Understood
dax 2017-03-09 14:35:34
"freenode's primary goal is to encourage and foster the development and use of free and open source software projects and other peer-directed communities producing broadly licensed creative output. Any project falling under this broad description is likely to be considered on-topic for the purposes of primary channel naming and other project services which we may provide, but individual decisions may be
dax 2017-03-09 14:35:34
made at the discretion of staff."
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:36:53
I guess I would open up that question then to the group - some used the specific term "creating freely licensed output" which is why it stood out to me...
amnet 2017-03-09 14:36:53
It's legalese.
amnet 2017-03-09 14:36:53
Which doesn't help my comfort levels at all.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:36:53
@dax: So yeah - that is incredibly broad and potentially open to any number of subjectivity issues
amnet 2017-03-09 14:36:59
I wouldn't call them issues.
dax 2017-03-09 14:37:11
which is why there's a groups team that handles it, and why the last bit says "at the discretion of staff"
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:37:29
I can think of a dozed questions right now just stemming form that description - but I will save the group here and potentially myself form some kind of flaming...just wait for staff to comment
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:37:43
sorry - *dozen
NightTrain 2017-03-09 14:37:46
You're talking to a staff member (dax).
amnet 2017-03-09 14:38:09
It's plausible that you can "open up" your project for more general access to the community.
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:38:23
OK - thanks man...
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:38:34
So dax - what's the call?
dax 2017-03-09 14:38:45
01:25 <@dax> freenode has a groups team that makes final decisions on such things and I am very happily not on it, but thusfar this does not seem like an on-topic peer-directed project producing broadly-licensed creative output.
amnet 2017-03-09 14:38:46
The idea as I understand it is mostly that it's not meant to pander to small hacker groups that just want a cloak.
dax 2017-03-09 14:38:50
from 13 minutes ago
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:39:01
ok - thx
amnet 2017-03-09 14:39:11
So invite-only type stuff and close-knit groups don't really cut it.
gildarts 2017-03-09 14:40:22
##chat should be single hash, we produce publicly available training material for training markov bots
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:40:26
@dax: Do I need to submit anything? Yes I did check the website - did not see anything but the last item on the Register channel page was "in doubt, ASK" - so here I am...
amnet 2017-03-09 14:40:37
But in general double-pound channels are fair game.
gildarts 2017-03-09 14:40:39
/jk
dax 2017-03-09 14:41:42
cyberzeus: for # or ##? if for #, i'd be interested in a link to your broadly-licensed creative output from your project, to start
dax 2017-03-09 14:41:43
if ##, no
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:42:13
@dax: that kinda what I was saying - we do not have any BLCO
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:42:41
But given your comment about the dedicated group, I was asking as to whether or not I need to take any further action to askk for review
dax 2017-03-09 14:43:10
i'm not sure what the point of review would be if you clearly don't meet the description of an on-topic project
elky 2017-03-09 14:43:13
you can, you probably shouldn't waste times on endeavors bound to fail
dax 2017-03-09 14:43:29
"no we don't have broadly-licensed creative output" seems pretty clear cut
cyberzeus 2017-03-09 14:44:37
Well, that is what I was asking above - is that a clear gate-criteria - doesn't say that on the freenode site...but if that's your direction here and now as the member of staff, then understood...
